Our Man Downtown

By wendy

April 21, 2008 2:41 PM | Link to this

DITTO, JB! I recognize this topic from a certain Thai food conversation… I would love to see downtown thrive, but in a local, meaningful way — the Waco way! Not in a plasticized, chained-up touristy way. I love this thread so much, I may just have to do a sister post to it— What does the rest of Waco need?

By Echoing & Adding

April 21, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this

You hit what I think are a lot of the obvious things you’d want in a vibrant, resident-friendly downtown.

Echoing you - park areas (some already in place and some coming), farmer’s market (should be relocated downtown), local history museum, live music venues (improving), art galleries, more retail (book/music stores).

I’d expand on the wider variety of restaurants. Bangkok Royal already offers great Thai, but the downtown options are thin. Indian and Mediterranean, which you mentioned, would be great. But we are also currently missing some more traditional options - a quality seafood place, a nice Italian place, and a good French restaurant are all glaring holes. Would be nice to swing El Siete Mares downtown.

And in place of a Trader Joe’s model, I’d put a Central Market in the wish list (obviously need more traffic to drive that, but a CM would draw from the Baylor area and other neighborhoods in and around Waco).

By citizen kane

April 21, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this

I wonder if downtown developers ever envisioned the Food Stamp office in the same block as the Hippodrome and various Antique shops?

Well, they better now, because rumor is they are moving down there before the end of the year.

By Hal

April 21, 2008 4:33 PM | Link to this

J.B., I would love to see small shops such as boutiques, all types of small art gallaries, gift shops with one-of-a kind crafted affordable gifts, a woodworking/crafting/artist complex for artisans and artists, some place I could buy off the shelf glasses, and a place for the Saturday People to go. If you build it, they will come. There are some great artists in Waco that sell their art elsewhere. But the goods need to fit into the budget of the Waco salaries. Then the tourist dollars will come. Cause the average salary of most places is higher than Waco.

By Thomas Lopez

April 21, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this

Here’s my top 5:

By Big Ron

April 21, 2008 7:40 PM | Link to this

None of this work without parking spaces!

By 747

April 21, 2008 8:14 PM | Link to this

KEEP WACO WACKO !!! this is a WAR cry for our future to GO GREEN & KEEP IT CLEAN the last thing waco needs is smoke poison de-humanized trafficing, pummeled with construction fallout. the BIG idea is to STOP the old ugly urban-jungle,instead of rebuild, RECYCLE!

By Fred

April 21, 2008 9:03 PM | Link to this

Downtown Waco needs port-a-potties on every block so that our beloved homeless can stop urinating and deficating on the sidewalks and on the doorsteps. The exception being the new Greater Waco Chamber building. The new building should be a “target of human waste” for the homeless. Let the creative urination begin.

By mikey

April 21, 2008 10:41 PM | Link to this

Downtown Waco needs to ship all the homeless somewhere else. A homeless man in Temple stabs another homeless man. If all the homeless here were that violent then downtown Waco would be worse off than Bagdad. They would have the Al-Quada outnumbered anyway.

By Scott Baker

April 22, 2008 12:10 AM | Link to this

I’d love to see a men’s specialty shop. A place where you could get a straight razor shave and a haircut. A place where you could get a massage and a shot of bourbon. A place where you could buy a good cigar and maybe a sharp pair of cufflinks.

I’m trying to talk my father into opening a Middle Eastern restaurant. He was raised an Arab and knows his food. His neighbor from growing up in Nazareth is ready to come over and be his head chef. I’m working on him.

I keep trying to find a taker for my idea for a new tattoo parlor: Downtown Waco Ink. The jokes write themselves.

I’d like to see a yoga studio too. I miss that from NYC.

Lastly, I’d really like to see a farmers market too. With as much produce as is grown around here, I think we could have a fantastic one.

By map

April 22, 2008 8:52 AM | Link to this

A river walk that people could actually find would be nice— when driving on University Dr., you don’t even realize it is “down” there. A river walk that doesn’t flood every time it rains would also be nice. A river walk with railings - you can’t take a toddler “down” there- they could walk right off the edge. A river walk with something else to do besides looking over your shoulder “down” there would be nice, (ie) eateries, shops. And by the way what I mean by “down” there is 12-15 feet BELOW street level. A river walk with patrolling, walking Police Officers would be nice.

By michael

April 22, 2008 8:53 AM | Link to this

I live downtown. My place is one of the coolest pads in the whole town—hands down. I wouldn’t trade it for the plushest monster in Hidden Valley even if it was free. BUT it would be nice to have a few more amenities within walking distance such as: *dry cleaner *upscale grocery store *child care *gym *Video store *independent restaurants *marina *movie theater that shows independent films and serves alcohol

By Al

April 22, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this

I’d really love to see the parking lot/Bank of America property that is bound by 5th, 6th, Washington and Austin Avenues would become a park plaza.

Close down Washington Avenue in front of the courthouse and create a park where the parking lot is.

This would be beautiful and something that part of downtown doesn’t have.

By mikey

April 22, 2008 10:14 AM | Link to this

Whatever you do to downtown Waco, it will not be safe due to the number of homeless there. I watched a guy Sunday morning walk from one church to another as the services let out so he could bum money. I made it a point to see where he went from there. He walked several block to a motel where he saw a guy standing around. He motioned him over behind a dumpster and next thing I saw was a little cloud of smoke, when he came out seconds later he had no cigarette, what were they smoking?

By Scott Baker

April 22, 2008 10:40 AM | Link to this

Wow, mikey, I hadn’t thought about that. I suppose you’re right; we should all just abandon our plans right now. A handful of homeless people are sure to outsmart and outmove all of the progress we’re making. Surely none of us are thinking about ways to improve public perception and safety and we’re turning a blind eye to the homeless. If only we were more like other cities that don’t have any homeless people, then surely we could move forward. Man, if only we’d thought of this sooner! Darn it all.

In case you didn’t read it in J.B.’s post earlier about the PID meeting, we followed up the big police report about security with a big report about homelessness in Waco. We’re working together with the City and private services to help address the homeless problem in Waco. We want to aid compassionate solutions that will achieve tangible success. We don’t want to “ship all the homeless somewhere else” as you so tastelessly suggested. We want to help them as a part of building a better community for us all here.

Back to the topic at hand, I’d also love to see the riverwalk develop further. There’s a good framework in place, but I can’t wait to see what the development of the Shelton Hotel combined with the Mammoth Site, MCC, a marina, the zoo, Downtown, and Baylor together could generate in terms of river traffic and a string of destination developments on the river. It’s exciting!

By wendy

April 22, 2008 11:06 AM | Link to this

Ahhh, Scott, I like your idea. I’ve got no need for cufflinks or a shave, but a shot of bourbon, a cigar and massage sound lovely. If you build it, I will come :)

By mikey

April 22, 2008 1:31 PM | Link to this

Yes, I saw that report and I also commented Stevie Wonder must have done the census count for that report. There is not a “handful” of homeless. Its more “battalion” sized. And as downtown gets more developed they are going to gravitate there for the opportunities that will exist. You cant saturate downtown with wanna-be cops and expect everything to be safe. Some of the most crime ridden places in Waco are within rock throwing (pardon the pun) distance of the Waco Police Station. Right under their nose! and they cant control it. Other cities around Waco and I wont mention names, pick them up and if they cant find ant warrants on them to put them in jail then they are escorted to the city limit and adios just like Rambo. I know it was just a movie, but remember what he did?

By Derek Tonkin

April 22, 2008 1:45 PM | Link to this

I’d like to see a theater built in the mold of the Coco Bongo club from The Mask (sorry I can’t think of a better example off-hand) where you could eat, drink, mingle and enjoy a film. I DO NOT think that this should be confined to independent films nor should it be confined strictly to films at all. A place that could show a movie, host a comedian, or band, or small stage production (it would also be ideal for “murder mystery dinner”-style productions) would have enough flexibility to be very successful here. If I had the money I’d do it myself and if someone would like to lend the money I’d be glad to oversee it (wink, wink). I understand the desire for local dining and the idea of moving El Siete Mares is great but I don’t think that having chain restaurants as well is a bad idea. I think that both are needed to make it all work.

By mikey

April 22, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this

Oh by the way Scott, I love your idea of the specialty shops. I cant remember the last time I saw a straight razor. Even though I raise a large garden for my family, I love Farmers Markets. Even though I am not familiar with middle-eastern culture I look forward to seeing your dad establish a place here. I will buy you a cigar and we’ll toast to the new downtown when it comes about. Maybe by then we’ll be able to buy Cuban cigars. Join us Fred?

By Publius

April 22, 2008 1:50 PM | Link to this

Scott, you might check out Downtown Barber Shop two blocks up Austin Avenue from the Hippodrome. Tito will give you a haircut for $10 in which he’ll trim the back of your neck and over your ears with a straight razor.

I imagine he’ll also give you a shave.

I’ve seen neither a cigar nor bourbon in there, but you might give it a shot.

By mikey

April 22, 2008 2:35 PM | Link to this

El Siete Mares could move between two crack houses and I would still go there. Check out Tito’s hair tonic bottles. (hint) Are you sure that is not Bay Rum or something else in there? Seriously, Tito is a fine man, he is one of the nicest fellows in town.

By Twinklebell

April 22, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this

I would love to see a few more skyscrapers, we only have one really. We don’t need a whole bunch but a few. I agree with most everybody’s ideas. I really like the idea of a nice park in the middle of downtown and the farmers market. I really like Austin’s and DFW’s downtowns maybe we could take the best of them and put them in ours. Afterall, we are right between them.

By j.b. smith

April 22, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this

Tito had a shoeshine guy in there for a while. Man, he got those shoes shinier in about two minutes than I could have done on my own in half an hour, and put some new laces in. Shoe shine stands…. Add that to my list.

By Fred

April 22, 2008 7:14 PM | Link to this

Why don’t we call the Waco Downtown area….Baylor Bear Grounds II. The over-priced Loft Apartments and exclusive, exspensive Resturants are built for our rich, little darlings at Baylor University and all of “daddy’s money” which supports the little Baylor brats. Who is kidding who? The new and improved Downtown Waco is merely an extention of our pompus and elite Baylor University and it’s hyprocracy. Everyone will bow down to kiss Downtown’s Green and Gold buttocks. Working class Wacoans will not be welcome and need not apply. Working class Wacoans will be out-priced and excluded from the Downtown Baylor area.

By j.b. smith

April 22, 2008 8:49 PM | Link to this

All right, let’s get back on topic: What specific things would folks like to see downtown?

By KW

April 22, 2008 9:03 PM | Link to this

A little shop where you can buy a soda or snack at any time of the day (at least during business hours). Maybe a cool coffee shop…especially if you could bring your dog. AND A DOG PARK!

By Publius

April 22, 2008 10:05 PM | Link to this

Folks, downtown needs a gas station / convenience store type place. It need not have 47 pumps like the ones on I-35, Valley Mills, and Highway 6. I wonder if someone could renovate one of the old vacant gas stations downtown.

Also, anyone got a good use for the old Bird-Kultgen building?

By william

April 22, 2008 10:31 PM | Link to this

I think Waco has a better chance of having a great vibrant downtown to Houston,Dallas,Austin,etc…because our downtown area is located in a great area thats right off the highway,and lots of people work downtown. Adding expensive lofts is a step,but if you really want to get people downtown! You need clubs,movies,parks,etc!…

I remember elm street use to be sooooooo packed! Just think of Austin Ave or something just like it with all the cars parked on the side of the road and people migrating from club to club!

By mikey

April 23, 2008 12:35 AM | Link to this

And tell me. Why did Elm St. vacate? From MLK to Clifton. What happened? Lets hear someone else’s view for a change.

By 747

April 23, 2008 1:49 AM | Link to this

My Wish List

By C.F.M.

April 23, 2008 9:05 AM | Link to this

Mickey, I remember when I was kid, many moons ago, that east waco was a booming business area, and suddedly when I came back from the service it was’nt there, I was told by various folks that between the crime, and taxs, and lack of business, due to the crime rate, that it just slowly faded in the sunset, I personally do’nt know what happen, I am just repeating what I was told, but, I am courious as to what really happen…

By j.b. smith

April 23, 2008 9:51 AM | Link to this

Elm Street is a different topic but a good one for a future discussion (of course Carol Dugat is already on the case). I’m also interested in Elm Street’s past and future and how it relates to downtown. We’ll come back to that later.

By Dale

April 23, 2008 9:52 AM | Link to this

At one point in its history, Waco had the best of San Francisco, Chicago, and New York City all rolled into one. Why they let it go, I’ll never understand.

By alee

April 23, 2008 10:22 AM | Link to this

downtown needs a wonderful bakery…and lots of LIVE music!

By Scott Baker

April 23, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

Dale, we own that building you’re talking about and I’m in the midst of planning to restore that entire wall mural as a part of the larger renovations that we’re doing all over the theatre grounds. The brick is in very bad shape, but don’t worry, we’ll find a way.

That leads into a comment about what 747 said. Under absolutely no circumstances should we make a policy of demolishing vacant buildings or factories Downtown. We must make every effort to preserve everything that we can. That doesn’t mean that we can’t make different use of the spaces, but those buildings are the character of Downtown. They help make Downtown Waco unique and different from any other downtown in America. New construction should be done to harmonize with the existing architecture, not replace it.

I’ve heard a couple of people say it, and I’ll echo it, a dog park would be very nice.

By 747

April 23, 2008 12:11 PM | Link to this

“We must make every effort to preserve everything that we can. That doesn’t mean that we can’t make different use of the spaces, but those buildings are the character of Downtown.”

i agree somewhat especially about use of space and RECYCLE buildings that are viable for restoration but factories and deterorating bldg. are lost cause and usually not unique with exceptions like historic purposes

By mikey

April 23, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this

J.B. I for the life of me can not understand why people in Waco think that Downtown stops at the river. A person would think that a different country existed on the other side. Your Downtown blog should be about the EW side also. Have you been hangin around those white boys at the Waco CoC again? If Downtown is the entree then East Waco adds the flavor and the spice. This was so true in the 50s and 60s. By the way I am licking my chops at some of the ideas I am reading about.

By Derek Tonkin

April 23, 2008 2:00 PM | Link to this

Mikey, I think that people think that because almost all the buildings on the east side are presently vacant (or at least appear to be). I LOVE Tony DeMaria’s and I think it is THE answer to J.B.’s desire for a good barbecue place. The new Y and other development of the old Paul Quinn campus is great and there is the library there but that’s almost it. I agree with you that the revitalization efforts should extend all the way to I-35 on the east side. I guess we’ll see what actually happens though.

By j.b. smith

April 23, 2008 2:33 PM | Link to this

Mikey and Derek: I ate at Tony DeMaria’s today and it was great as always. I’d still like to have great BBQ within walking distance. Also, I go to the Doris Miller Y, though not nearly as often as I wish, and I enjoy shopping at Empire Seed. I’d love to have more reasons to cross the river. Whether Elm Street is really part of downtown is an open question, but I agree it could be and should be. We’ll come back to that topic soon, I promise.

Keep the ideas coming. This is fun.

By Derek Tonkin

April 23, 2008 3:31 PM | Link to this

I think that it wouldn’t take much to convince Uncle Dan to relocate to downtown (or at least add a location there) he’s moved around in the past and used to have a location out on Hewitt Dr. I know that I’m the one who said he’s not opposed to chains but this is one area where I think we need to have local fare downtown. And just to bolster my support for chains, I’d LOVE to see a Tucanos.

By Chains

April 23, 2008 4:12 PM | Link to this

There are chains, and there are chains. Never been to a Tucanos, but a churrascaria would be great, and it looks nice. A Fogo de Chao or Texas de Brazil might be expecting a bit much, but Texas de Brazil does have a restaurant in Baton Rouge. There’s an Estancia Churrascaria in Austin that has excellent food but is a notch below, say, Fogo ambiance and price-wise.

Long say of saying — a chain like a Tucanos or a Texas de Brazil is one thing. That would be great. No need for something like another Applebee’s downtown, though.

By Fred

April 23, 2008 7:21 PM | Link to this

While everyone was expressing their “pipe-dreams” about exclusive Downtown Waco a fellow human being was shot to death (just across the river) in East Waco in a bloody drive-by MURDER last night. What does a bloody murder in East Waco have to do with the beautiful Downtown Waco development you ask? Well to begin with, the violent murder occured less than one mile from your Downtown Waco. Still, what does a poor man’s violent drug-related slaughter have to do with the New Greater Waco Chamber Palace Downtown? The English poet John Donne can answer your angry question………”every man’s death deminishes me”. This drive-by MURDER on Sherman Street in East Waco deminishes all of Waco. May God deliever East Waco from the violence and suffering of Crack Cocaine. I remind all of you; there are only TWO Waco Police Officers Patroling all of East Waco. This ongoing neglect of East Waco is wrong.

By j.b. smith

April 23, 2008 10:47 PM | Link to this

Fred, I don’t question your sincerity. But it seems to me that maybe your real calling is to help the downtrodden, steer our city’s youth away from crime and help rejuvenate East Waco. If so, sitting at your computer at all hours commenting on our blogs is not the best way to accomplish your ends. You can blame the business interests downtown all you want, but I guarantee if downtown burned down and the developers all went home, East Waco would be no better off. Maybe what East Waco needs is your hard work. Fred, I think that bell is tolling for thee.

By cantw82leave

April 24, 2008 9:13 AM | Link to this

To Scott Baker: 4 years ago I noticed a plethora of empty buildings downtown and began making calls to open a yoga studio. Of those who even bothered to return my call, no one seemed interested in even showing me spaces, much less renting one. One man even told me that “Waco didn’t need any more ice cream parlors.” Seriously, this community isn’t ready and I am no longer interested. The downtown project is simply a thinly veiled ploy for Baylor to keep their whiny students entertained.

By C.F.M.

April 24, 2008 9:32 AM | Link to this

A few years,[ not that many] ago, we were going to rent a couple buildings for antiques and other things, and the owners wanted us to invest our money to the tune of about 100,000.00 + to re-do both buildings and pay him rent on top of that, hmmmm, we decided, and it didnt take to long, not to do it. We do not invest our money into some ones building, so they can cancel the lease later, and charge more rent for the next renter and here we have re-done his building, that may be a very large determent to renting anything in the downtown area.. Unless one can buy the building out right, but it seems ,at that time anyway, they dont want to sell the building they want someone to re -do them, and then they collect the rent…

By 747

April 24, 2008 11:10 AM | Link to this

“The downtown project is simply a thinly veiled ploy for Baylor to keep their whiny students entertained. ” CORRECT its very similar to downtown dallas were baptist churches own virtually all vacant bldg real estate. they should tear it all down imo and do a superfund cleanup and immient domain takeover to restore parks and REAL recreation

By Twinklebell

April 24, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this

I would love to see a dog park, my boxer needs some more space to run! One downtown would be great, but I wish there would be 5 or so spread all over Waco. Because I don’t live far from downtown but I definitely don’t live within walking distance.

By 747

April 24, 2008 12:37 PM | Link to this

Downtown real estate doesn’t want Yoga ???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lBoJpx8Wn8

By Scott Baker

April 24, 2008 1:35 PM | Link to this

“The downtown project is simply a thinly veiled ploy for Baylor to keep their whiny students entertained.”

Garbage. If you sincerely believe this, I expect you have specific names of people within the Baylor Administration who are active in propagating Downtown development. No? Really? You don’t? I’m shocked.

See, this kind of argument is almost laughable at this point. It’s been subtle, but I’m sure I’m not the only one who has noticed a shift in focus of the cynics and the critics and the humbugs. Even as recently as a year ago you were all saying, “It’ll never happen! It’s a pipe-dream! Downtown won’t develop!” And now that it’s happening and developing and you’ve lost that argument, the opposition narrative has changed to, “It’s too expensive! It’s for Baylor! It’s not enough!” And I can only marvel and wonder what weak arguments will be trotted out when you realize that it will be affordable and embraced more by the city at large than by students alone. Look at this thread and how everything that we’ve been accomplishing has sparked people’s imaginations! And it’s all possible!

As for four years ago, well, the world was a different place then. So, cantw82leave, if your attention span is really that short and you’re truly no longer interested, then I can only conclude that Downtown is fortunate that your yoga studio never materialized. If you’re really that eager to leave, please, be our guest. The people contributing to Downtown for the benefit of our entire community are dedicated, hard-working, vision-driven people who are planning for the long-term.

Keep your eyes peeled for that dog park and more public spaces. We are all committed to a Downtown that is pedestrian friendly and one that incorporates the natural beauty of our location.

J.B., the more I think about it, the more I hope more people make commitments to public art. I’m going to make sure we do here at the Hippodrome as a part of our upcoming renovations. I think we need a lot more of that.

By Fred

April 24, 2008 4:06 PM | Link to this

There are local investors who are going to lose their shirts in the Downtown Waco Development Scam. Wait and see. As JP Morgan once said: “There’s a sucker born every minute”.

By Hmmm

April 24, 2008 4:13 PM | Link to this

Fred, you might consider thinking long and hard about who’s the sucker.

By Dale

April 24, 2008 9:16 PM | Link to this

By the way Fred. JP Morgan didn’t say that. It was Phineas Barnum of the world reknown Barnum and Bailey Circus. SUCKER!!

By Fred

April 25, 2008 5:16 AM | Link to this

Downtown Waco is surrounded by the crime and violence of Waco. Many times the crime spills over into the Downtown area. There was a double-stabbing at Brazos Nights along with thefts, robberies and purse-snatchings in the Hilton parking lot. A few months ago there was the Bank Robbery by the crazy homeless man wielding a knife. Gunshots can be heard (regularly) just across the river in East Waco. Assaults and fights breakout in the Downtown Waco Bars. The Downtown Waco Development will not be in a bullet-proof bubble. Go to Downtown Waco at night at your own risk. There are few Waco Police to protect you.

By Kyle

April 25, 2008 7:28 AM | Link to this

Chipotle Mexican Grill (NYSE: CMG)

By Hal

April 25, 2008 10:41 AM | Link to this

Fred, Every time I read one of your blogs, I can’t help humming Fred Rogers’ song, “What Do You Do With the Mad that You Feel”.

By FEDUP

April 25, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this

I would settle for an authentic Thai or Vietnamese restaurant that serves a delicious wet noodle bowl. The ones we have now offer dry noodle bowls but apparantly have never heard of wet ones. In fact,I don’t think I’ve met anyone in Waco that knows what a wet noodle bowl is.

By Fred

April 25, 2008 3:03 PM | Link to this

Hey JB…..Waco leads the State in per capita poverty. Twenty-five per cent of all Wacoans live below the poverty level (1 in 4 Wacoans are dirt poor). What were you saying about the quality of life in Waco JB? Number one in POVERTY JB……now, built me an exclusive Baylor Loft Apartment Downtown and tell me about prosperous Waco JB?

By Ouch

April 25, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this

Wrong, Fred. Waco does not lead the state in poverty. But the numbers are bad.

Maybe you should get off your computer and help raise the standard of living in East Waco. Maybe an influx of jobs would help. Hey, I know, you could find a way to support development in the heart of Waco that would create jobs. Wonder if there’s any of that going on anywhere…

By C.F.M.

April 25, 2008 4:29 PM | Link to this

Fred, I am tired of your whining so I am going to give you a little advice, here goes, you get 1000-1500 of your peers, registered voters, to sign a petition, and in that petition you lay out your greviences, and you get about 4-5 years of facts and figures for crime in your area, and you take that to the Council, and you present all of it to them, and you tell them what the problem is, do not rant and rave they will not pay attention to you, but if you do as I suggest, mayhaps something good will come out of it. There are no guarantees in the world, only that we all eventially die..Setting here in this blog is silly, nothing good will come of it, and you are, and probably have, lost all credibility.

By 747

April 25, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this

“FEDUP I would settle for an authentic Thai or Vietnamese restaurant that serves a delicious wet noodle bowl. The ones we have now offer dry noodle bowls but apparantly have never heard of wet ones. In fact,I don’t think I’ve met anyone in Waco that knows what a wet noodle bowl is.”

best comment so far IMHO in the past a lot of chinese shops didnt make authentic because of western tastes but even if the said restraunts dont have ‘wet noodle’ they could adopt this

By James

April 25, 2008 6:31 PM | Link to this

Alas, Chipotle is coming to Waco, but not to Downtown. For some reason they are building next to the McDonalds at Valley Mills and Wooded Acres.

They would do better if they choose to locate in Downtown or the 4th/5th street food court at I-35.

By Riley

April 25, 2008 9:26 PM | Link to this

there is a lot to do for adults in waco i guess you could say. clubs and bars and hotels and stuff like that. but theres not much for kids/teenagers. mainly there is just the mall, the movies, bowling (not very fun to most teenagers here in waco), and kitty land. the most boring of all. i think there should be at least one thing downtown that is actually fun. like a (smallish) amusement park type thing or something. but with FAST go-karts and a COOL putt putt. or a nicer place to hang out and have something to do on the weekends for not just kids/teenagers but for the whole family besides the same ole stuff. and then i think there should be new kinds of cool stores maybe. or like you said museums or parks or something. =) something of the sort.

By Fred

April 26, 2008 7:12 AM | Link to this

Hey Ouch and CFM……welcome to the Fred’s-in-your-Head Club. CFM just gave a one hundred and forty three word paragraph devoted to Fred and Fred alone. Thank you CFM (not a record but impressive). No; I will not stop my obnoxious “whining”. Sometimes Fred likes to have a little cheese with Fred’s “whine”. Waco City Council meetings you ask? No; this is a much bigger and better Forum for Fred’s twisted entertainment. Fred has an opinion just like Fred has an (well, you know).

By Onlooker

April 26, 2008 12:45 PM | Link to this

How about an Imax Theater and a multicultural book store/lounge/art gallery. Those would be cool in downtown Waco.

By Big Ron

April 26, 2008 8:21 PM | Link to this

Where is everyone going to park for ALL this? No one can stay in business with only ONE car parked in front…..that’s why downtown in any small city has been vacated.

By Onlooker

April 26, 2008 9:10 PM | Link to this

That’s true. Many grants are denied due to parking issues.

By Scott Baker

April 26, 2008 11:35 PM | Link to this

We’ve been talking about parking issues for the better part of a year now. Don’t worry folks, it’s not like there’s no hand at the wheel here. There are many hands at the wheel and there will be plenty of parking. I walked a three block radius around the Hippodrome this past Thursday when we had a show. We were packed, the Palladium was packed, the Green Room was packed, and there was still plenty of parking available. By the time there actually would be parking problems, solutions will be in place.

By Fred

April 27, 2008 4:39 AM | Link to this

While you are parked in Downtown Waco don’t be surprised to find your car “broken into” when you return from walking four blocks back to your car. Thefts and car “break-ins” are UP in the Downtown Waco area.

By Verne Pitts

April 27, 2008 9:25 AM | Link to this

What I don’t want to see downtown is a lot of taxpayers money being spent to line the pockets of a few greedy people.

By Scott Baker

April 27, 2008 12:42 PM | Link to this

Verne, public money isn’t being spent on Downtown development. The current projects are all privately funded. The only taxpayer involvement will be increased tax revenues from successful development.

As for your vehicles, well, despite dramatically increasing the number of vehicles in the Downtown over the past year, the number of vehicular burglaries went up two. As in 2. As in, out of the hundreds and thousands of more cars that were in the Downtown, only two more were reported broken into. And vehicular theft? It went down from 8 to 1 from 2006 to 2007.

By Parking

April 27, 2008 3:06 PM | Link to this

Parking around heavily-trafficked entertainment areas in big urban downtowns is often pert near impossible. Doesn’t stop development there. Not that we shouldn’t worry about parking, but if we ever have serious parking troubles it will be because we actually managed to get a lot more traffic downtown.

Now, reviving the old trolley system, that would be a nice way to relieve parking issues if they arise in a serious manner.

By The Daily Cynic

April 27, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this

As we understand it, at least two parking garages will be built around the Heritage Square area (one by the new student housing on Washington, one on the current Hilton parking lot) that should alleviate any parking dilemmas that might arise.

Scott’s right — downtown parking is plentiful right now. Especially if you’re willing to walk a couple of blocks. Sadly, we doubt most people would actually consider walking from RiverSquare to Treff’s (to say nothing of walking to, say, the library. Que lastima!).

People in real cities walk. UT students we know think nothing of a 15-minute walk from bar to bar on Saturday night.

We love walking downtown and checking out the buildings, but I guess we’re kind of (very amateur) architecture geeks.

We love imagining Waco as it once was, and could be again.

As J.B. has said, walking improves your eyesight.

And as we like to say, it makes you love your city more.

By More Parking

April 27, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this

The Daily Cynic is right. Parking is plentiful. And if downtown Waco continues to develop, people (both Wacoans and Baylor students) will have to adapt to walking just like people already do in vibrant downtown areas. It really does add to the experience — and it’s good for you. We could do with a little more exercise, anyway.

By Doug

April 27, 2008 5:03 PM | Link to this

I think someone mentioned it, but I’d like to see an independent bookstore that keeps late hours and has events. and coffee.

We need more tables and benches for folks who work downtown (me) to go outside and eat lunch. The benches at Heritage Square are perpendicular to the tables rather than parallel - not only do they look odd, but only one person can sit and eat.

Ane we need lot’s more good art sprinkled all around. It doesn’t just have to be sculpture - downtown Minneapolis has poetry set in the sidewalks. I like that Scott Baker is committed to preserving the old advertising. It appears that the folks renovating the Hoffman Banana building are saving it’s old sign. We have lots of “ghost signs” if you look carefully (including some great ones on Elm). I hope that we can save them all.

And by the way - I’ve worked downtown for nearly 6 years and am renovating a home near downtown. I feel very safe even when working late.

By Fred

April 27, 2008 5:24 PM | Link to this

Once again, Scott Baker (manager of Waco’s Downtown haunted theatre) doesn’t know what he’s talking about. Scott Baker is making up Stats. Car break-ins are up and all thefts (not just car thefts) are up. Waco is infested with crime (for it’s small size) and Downtown Waco is no exception. Scott Baker can “slant” numbers all he wants but Waco’s crime is sky-high and Waco leads the State in per capita poverty. Waco’s empty business buildings will continue in this dead-horse town.

By Scott Baker

April 27, 2008 7:09 PM | Link to this

I don’t have time for this nonsense. I don’t know everything, nor do I claim to. But unlike some others, if I don’t know what I’m talking about, I hold my tongue.

Read it for yourself here. Those are the official numbers from the Waco Police Department.

By Fun

April 27, 2008 8:05 PM | Link to this

Fred, your desperation is amusing. Exciting things are happening, other folks are happy about it, and you can’t stand it. Posting non-sequiturs of bile and made-up stats - you’ve become a parody of yourself.

By Fred

April 27, 2008 9:13 PM | Link to this

More nonsense from Scott Baker. Comedy tonight Scott? Yes indeed, look at Waco PD stats. Let me summ it up: Downtown Assaults are UP, Downtown Car Break-ins are UP, Downtown Home Break-ins are UP, Downtown Vandalism is UP, Downtown Thefts are UP, and Downtown Fraud is UP. In the near future; there will be another case of Downtown Waco fraud to be investigated. When the Downtown Waco Development Profiteering Scandal hits the fan…..chaulk up another one in the Downtown Fraud catagory. Scott may hold his tounge, but he doesn’t hold his keyboard. Watch out for those Theatre Ghosts Scott Baker. Break a leg!

By Scott Baker

April 27, 2008 10:50 PM | Link to this

J.B. did a great job with the article, and it’s not like any of this really needs to be rehashed, but Fun is totally right.

Okay then, Downtown assaults are up. Yes, they rose by eight from 2006-2007. Despite all the added nightlife, residents, and activity, assaults rose only eight over the year. And as Chief Lanning pointed out, most of those were at bars and economy motels. You’re not in any danger walking Austin Ave. at night. I do it daily.

Car break-ins are up exactly two, as I’ve said before. Not exactly cause for alarm.

Home break-ins are up a whopping five over the year despite more people living Downtown.

Criminal mischief is up only 11 incidents over the year despite the new businesses, restaurants, and such.

Theft is the biggest increase of all crime in Downtown over the year: an incredible fifteen whole added occurrences. No matter that there were hundreds and thousands of more opportunities with all the activity, it only rose fifteen incidents.

But robbery, vehicular theft, sexual assault, narcotics, and miscellaneous crime dropped while murder stayed the same: zero.

This is not exactly an inspiring case for the cause of giving Downtown development a black eye.

And lest there be any further confusion, I’m not known at all to hold my tongue. My overly large mouth is probably my most glaring weakness. But as I said, when I don’t know what I’m talking about I’ve learned that it is much more prudent to keep silent. Some others here should take note. In this instance, I know exactly what I’m talking about and I tell it to everyone who’ll listen. I am proud of this community, I believe in the future of Waco and Downtown, and I love doing my part to its utmost to help this city be all that it can be.

By Kyle

April 27, 2008 10:57 PM | Link to this

I would like everyone reading this blog to know one thing, the entire state of New Mexico has not even one Chipotle. To hear that one is coming to town, regardless of location, is cause for great rejoice.

To those who espouse postings with nothing but negative conjecture, I propose reflection on the singular quote by Edmund Burke, “All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.”

By Publius

April 27, 2008 11:49 PM | Link to this

Fred, just out of curiosity, what would you have the City of Waco do? Because at this point, I’m honestly not sure.

If you’re suggesting that the police department should reallocate its manpower to focus on suppressing crime in downtown and East Waco, then let’s have a discussion on where police manpower is currently deployed.

If, on the other hand, you’re suggesting that Waco hire more police officers, then lay your blame just about anywhere but at the feet of the City Council. For the umpteenth time, your city tax dollars are not being used for downtown development. The money used is from the downtown improvement district - those people voluntarily pay MORE taxes. It’s like passing the hat with the tax office making sure you put something in.

Otherwise, where will Waco get money to pay for additional police officers. If you want to blame George W. Bush and the Republicans for cutting many of Clinton’s community policing initiatives which gave federal money to cities to hire additional police officers, that’s fine. But the only way the City of Waco can hire more police is to raise your taxes. And if you rent, I’ll almost guarantee your landlord will raise your rent. The only folks who get off without an increased cost of living are those in government housing which is exempt from the property tax rolls.

By mikey

April 28, 2008 2:14 AM | Link to this

And the Waco P.D. seeks to move its headquarters to the Hillcrest Tower? Hmmm, I wonder who lives out there? At least where the HQ is now they have to drive up and down 4th and 5th Streets and Waco Dr. to get to where they are going. At least they will have a birdseye view of the Landon Branch, Dean Highland, H.O.T. and Mountainview Neighborhoods. The rich white folks win out again!

By Derek Tonkin

April 28, 2008 9:06 AM | Link to this

Mikey by your reasoning the rich white folks have been getting screwed for the past 20+ years that the headquarters has been where it is. This may surprise you but not everything is a race issue. It is difficult to increase your police force when your current facility is out of space. Some on here contend that we need a larger police force and the Hillcrest tower allows us to have the space to grow at a really low price per square foot. I would also contend that it is not in a “rich white” neighborhood but rather at the meeting point between the upper and lower classes.

By Twinklebell

April 28, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this

I have to agree with Derek. I live 3 blocks from Hillcrest and by no means am I rich. We do have a few nice houses but the majority is right in between. Our neighborhoods are getting worse. I seriously live right between. You go one block down and there are drug dealers and then you go one block up and there’s nice houses with nice vehicles. Our police force does need more room and I think Hillcrest would be perfect. It doesn’t take long to get to lower class neighborhoods. Just got to drive down Herring. It doesn’t take long to get to upper class neighborhoods. Just got to drive down Hillcrest. Its right in between.

By Publius

April 28, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this

Mikey, you give us something we can work with. I don’t know what I think about abandoning the old police headquarters in favor of the move to Hillcrest. Further, it just seems that as Waco grows, we may need to shift to the idea of precinct sub-stations, much like we have with fire stations.

You get a petition together urging the Waco city council to put a police substation in East Waco, and I’d sign it. That’s a workable solution, and with all the money they’re supposedly saving from buying the Hillcrest tower instead of building a new police HQ, it sounds like the city could afford to renovate an existing building.

By mikey

April 28, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this

Publicus; You have something there, That former church on the corner of Garrison and Waco Dr. Fred is so fond of would make a fine Police Substation. Plenty of room, plenty of parking, right in the crack houses back yard. I,m serious though, a real Police Substation right in the middle of East Waco, not just a dogcatchers office like in the back of the east Waco Library. This could work. Lets see what kind of feedback we get on this. Great Idea. Right Fred?

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August 26, 2008 6:06 PM | Link to this

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